Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

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Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Jonthekiwi » Fri Aug 28, 2009 3:37 pm

Yesterday I visited the underground station with Melissa from CBT Waikato and some staff from Hamilton City Council.

Despite being tagged, amazingly enough both Hamilton Central station signs have been left untagged! To clean it up it is mainly graffiti removal. It has lighting sockets still, though probably damaged so would need replacing.

The most disturbing thing to see was the old ramp, which went up to the old NZR ticket office, has been basically destroyed and totally unusable by the foundations of The Warehouse built above it. However, I have been advised that for a future access point down to the station, from the road, the Hamilton City Council have purchased a strip of land on the side of The Warehouse building, which could have an enterance built down to the station.

Still, isn't it crazy the officials, the council at the time included, let such an asset be stripped of its access ramp. How much would it cost to build an underground platform in the heart of the CBD today?

I have take photos which I am going to post on the website soon.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby jarbury » Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:36 pm

Photos!

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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Cogload » Sat Aug 29, 2009 9:54 am

Hells teeth and I thought we were bad for spray painting everything in sight..... :o
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby pickle » Sat Aug 29, 2009 12:50 pm

I have grand plans for Hamilton Central which includes tram-trains from Te Rapa to Claudlands, Waikato University and Cambridge
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Daniel » Sat Aug 29, 2009 9:32 pm

Is there enough room for more than single track?
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby kaiwhara » Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:41 pm

No

Daniel wrote:Is there enough room for more than single track?
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby kaiwhara » Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:43 pm

Come on! Let's get real here!

Hamilton is not big enough to warrant anything like that whatsoever, and there is no money in the pot with which to do any such thing!

The sooner some people on this forum get their head out of the clouds and start being realistic the better...

Of course, if you are personally funding this well.....

louis wrote:I have grand plans for Hamilton Central which includes tram-trains from Te Rapa to Claudlands, Waikato University and Cambridge
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby K270UB6 » Sat Aug 29, 2009 11:17 pm

louis wrote:I have grand plans for Hamilton Central which includes tram-trains from Te Rapa to Claudlands, Waikato University and Cambridge

This seems like efficient transport to me.
I don't see it being better transport for Hamilton though

kaiwhara wrote:Come on! Let's get real here!

Hamilton is not big enough to warrant anything like that whatsoever, and there is no money in the pot with which to do any such thing!

Hamilton will not benefit from rail due to its population. Its future population estimates show realistically that Rail won't head Hamiltons way for a long time. As for light rial, I agree with kaiwhara, the funds are just not there.

The sooner some people on this forum get their head out of the clouds and start being realistic the better...

Dreams and reality :twisted: :lol:

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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Jonthekiwi » Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:08 am

Couple of points before you all self derail yourselves.

1) Two tracks could be possible with some work.
2) Light rail could well work in Hamilton as many cities of the SAME SIZE around the world have light rail / heavy rail
3) Money is not a problem. This current Government found $1,000,000,000 to smother the Waikato in tarmac this week on a project with NO COST BENEFIT RATIO. Will and lack of education is the problem.
4) Hamiltons population well warrants rail connections to Auckland and Tauranga, and perhaps Rotorua. Auckland is a perfect start.

Until the roading lobby and Road Transport Forum are well removed from the beds of the politicians, expect more of the same. Once these bedfellows are separated, nothing significant in other transportation modes will get a look in the door in New Zealand. That is unless voters start to demand Better Transport!
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Daniel » Mon Aug 31, 2009 9:54 pm

I'm pretty sure Hamilton is heading towards 200,000 people. That's large enough to start at least consider corridors for light rail for future growth.

How populated was the grater Wellington region when they organised the commuter rail? If there's enough money in the pot for more motorways in Auckland then why not light rail for Hamilton?

I'm not saying they should built light rail or re-use that station and I'm keen to hear answers to those questions BTW.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Jonthekiwi » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:04 pm

Hamilton can easily sustain a light rail network in development now. Just so you know Hamilton has a city population of approx 120,000 and in the wider Hamilton 180,000. Compare this to the city of Ballarat ( the most central inland city in the State of Victoria, Australia) they have a city pop of 88,000 - but have 15 commuter trains per day to Melbourne! Hamilton has ZERO right now.

Help with the change to get WAIKATO COMMUTER TRAINS NOW!
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Daniel » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:21 pm

Jonthekiwi wrote:Hamilton can easily sustain a light rail network in development now. Just so you know Hamilton has a city population of approx 120,000 and in the wider Hamilton 180,000. Compare this to the city of Ballarat ( the most central inland city in the State of Victoria, Australia) they have a city pop of 88,000 - but have 15 commuter trains per day to Melbourne!
Yeah But Melbourne's a much bigger city than Auckland. Surely a large percentage of people in Ballarat work in Melbourne.
How many people do you reckon commute from Hamilton to Auckland every day?
Then again, there could of course be a case of running the service to eventually generate a larger patronage.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Jonthekiwi » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:38 pm

Thanks for asking the question. 686 according to the last census drive every morning to work in Auckland city and 300 odd drive to south Auckland for work. This census is 3 years old now, and saw growth on the 2001 census. All this information and a lot more of your questions pertaining to Waikato Commuter rail are in the 2009 Preliminary Business Case by EW. Just call them up for a copy to be posted to you.

In the Business Case they estimate year one for the Silver Fern to have a 75% seat load factor, so basically about 73 or the 96 available seats full. Though, as all public transport estimates have been below actual usage, I think it is fair to say these numbers will be higher.

The Business Case did NOT take into account using the Central Hamilton Underground station, which is very handy to the CBD, as it is right underneath it. Additionally, it do not take into account businesses, like one I know, wants to buy 10 to 20 seats on every service as that is how many people they move daily to Auckland.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby K270UB6 » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:40 pm

Daniel wrote:Then again, there could of course be a case of running the service to eventually generate a larger patronage.

Getting this return commuter service will be just a start.

Jonthekiwi wrote:Help with the change to get WAIKATO COMMUTER TRAINS NOW!

In terms of the commute to Auckland extra services should be provided for towns North of Hamilton where there are people that commute from places like Ngaruawahia and Huntly to South Auckland for work.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby kaiwhara » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:43 pm

Wouldn't the Waikato service provide for these towns anyway?

K270UB6 wrote:In terms of the commute to Auckland extra services should be provided for towns North of Hamilton where there are people that commute from places like Ngaruawahia and Huntly to South Auckland for work.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby K270UB6 » Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:17 am

Jonthekiwi wrote: Compare this to the city of Ballarat ( the most central inland city in the State of Victoria, Australia) they have a city pop of 88,000 - but have 15 commuter trains per day to Melbourne! Hamilton has ZERO right now.


Do you have the right comparison there?

Things I have learned....
Bendigo is further inland
The service duration from Balarat are 1 hour at 160km's :shock: on a 112km? route (Dare we punt the Silver Fern against a service like that?)
There are 15 services out and 18 services in
Plus 1 coach service out and 1 in
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby john-ston » Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:29 am

Jonthekiwi wrote:Hamilton can easily sustain a light rail network in development now.


Please, provide examples of cities of the size of Hamilton that has a light rail network now, preferably examples from the Anglo-Saxon world, and ones that aren't heritage trams.

Jonthekiwi wrote:Just so you know Hamilton has a city population of approx 120,000 and in the wider Hamilton 180,000. Compare this to the city of Ballarat ( the most central inland city in the State of Victoria, Australia) they have a city pop of 88,000 - but have 15 commuter trains per day to Melbourne! Hamilton has ZERO right now.


That is why I am confident that the Waikato Connection Mk III will work; even the Blue Mountains Line has a similar population catchment to the Hamilton run, and that has an electric service every hour during the off-peak, with additional services during peak. I think a similar situation exists for the Nambour Line in Brisbane.

Certainly, if the Waikato Connection Mk III does work, then one could use it as an excuse to purchase new DMUs for New Zealand and possibly push for some additional trial services on some other routes (Wellington to Napier, Wellington to New Plymouth, Wellington to Palmerston North via Masterton, Christchurch to Dunedin, Auckland to Tauranga and Auckland to Rotorua).
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Jonthekiwi » Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:21 am

And if the Waikato Connection departs from Hamilton Central (underground) even better. Imagine a Paris metro type enterance down to the station? Makes things just that much more enticing.

If this starts as a 3 x a day return (incl the Overlander) my only concern would be with the Overlander. It needs the timetable revised back to 2hrs again between the 2 cities.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby QuintinH » Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:33 am

Trondheim in Norway has a population of 168,000 compared to Hamilton city of 130,000 (plus waikato district and Waipa distrcit with another 80,000 or so). Trondheim a succesful single track light rail and an extensive bus network. I have other examples of light rail in small cities if you need them.

Obviously a smaller city needs a system appropriate to its size and Hamilton would be ideal for 2 or possibly 3 lines, they would replace some bus services and would increase patronage.

On the heavr rail side of things. There are currently at least 15 bus services from auckland to hamilotn and beyond per day. I just cant help but think that some of these could easily be replaced by rail. And the Hamilton CBD underground station would be ideal once its cleaned up and expanded.
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Re: Hamilton Central Station (underground) CBD

Postby Jonthekiwi » Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:49 am

The Hamilton Central underground station has a huge platform. Walking on it last week I would say it is about an 8 car platform. Apparently, when it was built it was envisaged to be the main station for the city.
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